Seaford Avenue School Referendum Approved

District voters give green light to a proposed $5 million 55 and older condominium development at former elementary school property.

Seaford School District voters have given their stamp of approval Wednesday to a proposed 55 and older condominium development at a former elementary school property.

Wednesday’s referendum on the $5 million Seaford Avenue School property sale to BK at Seaford, LLC was approved by 203 votes, 972 to 769. The approval paves the way for BK at Seaford, LLC, a subsidiary of The Engel Burman Group of Garden City, to construct 112 two-bedroom units on the 5.66-acre site at 2165 Seadord Ave. The developer now must obtain necessary zoning approvals from the Town of Hempstead before construction can begin on its planned "Seasons at Seaford" community. 

"This is a very good step forward," said Seaford Board of Education President Brian Fagan moments after the results were announced. "It is a long time coming." 

The Seaford Avenue School was closed by the district in 1981 and leased to Five Towns College until 1992 and then to Nassau BOCES until 2010. According to school officials, the sale’s approval will generate nearly $500,000 in additional tax revenue and save the district an estimated $100,000 on basic maintenance costs associated with the property.

BeeKay January 10, 2013 at 09:00 PM
James, please provide fact as to how the SD is neglecting education? As you can see from the dialogue above (supported with factual data from myself and Ergolic), the district has been trending upward in recent years, not downward. There is still much room for improvement, and hopefully admin. will continue to raise the educational bar. Looking forward to your response which I hope contains hard data, not subjective opinion. Thanks.
James Norton January 11, 2013 at 01:38 PM
Beekay, https://reportcards.nysed.gov/statewide/2011statewideCIR.pdf The above link will take you to the state report card. I'm not looking to bash but when I see things like a 60% proficiency rate in grade 4 Reading and Writing in 2009/2010 and a 25% proficiency rate for the same in 08/09 I am concerned. A 41% passing rate on the math regents doesn't help either. Anyone who reads this will interpret data differently. The point here is this district has a track record of wasting money, time and resources on non- education items. The road is, in my opinion, taking the focus away from the function of a school district. This should be left to the town or county who are capable of handling this type of project. The last thing we need is another grossly mishandled attempt at building a road.
Lorraine DeVita January 11, 2013 at 02:02 PM
@ beekay- while i agree we are trending upward- albeit slowly in some minds- people are concerned that we could be moving more expeditously if we narrowed our focuse to be MORE educationaly proactive. No one can debate that we havent made strides to improve education however some feel the priority of education is still NOT at the top of the list. Whether this is true or not the PERCEPTION is there and needs to be eradicated or shifted. This district needs to change its PR from other areas that they typically tout to be more inclusive of educational acheviements of students NOT involved with sports or music. We need to make it clear to the residents, taxpayers AND the students that we have a wealth of students who are academicaly achieving in many areas on a regular basis. While some strides HAVE been made in this area also with recent notices/articles of different groups accomplishments it should be done on a more regular basis. We need to insure that the STUDENTS understand the concept that excelling in EDUCATION is more important then excelling on the fields. We need to hold students who acheive educational "wins/accomplishments" so to speak in higher regard as someone to emulate. This would go a long way imho to help shift the perception that academics arent AS important to all. Shift the perception shift the glory. FOCUS on Education accomplishments.
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 02:15 PM
James, I agree there was a major "dip" in the 2008/2009 and 2009/2010 school years...one that was very concerning to me being a father of 3 young children in the district. I have been watching carefully the past couple of years and feel that this BOE and Admin have not neglected education as one could argue the former BOE and Admin teams did in the district, and the recent data supports my belief. BTW, the link you posted and the proficiency and passing rates you quoted are not Seaford's statistics. 41% passing rate on the math regents? Unless Seaford somehow tested 16,301 students in 2010-2011, this data is irrelevant in this discussion. And the 4th grade Reading & Writing numbers are based on over 60,000 tested.
Lorraine DeVita January 11, 2013 at 02:16 PM
also highlight the different groups , clubs/classes etc that are offered that arent associated with sports or music. We have MANY and no one knows about them. This could also go a long way in possibly exciting a student to join a club or class they wouldnt normaly even give a second thought to. Perhaps a publicized club/class/ teacher / student of the month. Let SEAFORD know that we have MANY students that arent athletes who arent musicians but who are acheivers in their own right in Other areas. SHIFT the paradigm to education -
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 02:21 PM
Here you go. I'm not saying the district has done outstanding, but it does not neglect education as you claim. 2009/2010 Report Card: https://reportcards.nysed.gov/files/2009-10/AOR-2010-280206030000.pdf 2008/2009 Report Card: https://reportcards.nysed.gov/files/2008-09/AOR-2009-280206030000.pdf
James Norton January 11, 2013 at 02:26 PM
Beekay, I apologize I inadvertently copied the wrong link. However the information contained in the links below doesn't paint the picture any better. Every arguement has two sides. As I said early the way data is interpreted depends on the reader. I just feel that we continue to fall behind other districts in our area. https://reportcards.nysed.gov/files/2010-11/CIR-2011-280206030003.pdf (elementary) https://reportcards.nysed.gov/files/2010-11/CIR-2011-280206030006.pdf (High School)
Joe January 11, 2013 at 02:26 PM
Newsday reports on all the school districts test scores, upon reviewing them Seaford seems inline with most, not 100% sure what stat's you are looking at is correct, but Newsday seemed to do a decent job in relationship to all district as a comparison. I don't disagree on the road being a Nassau County issue, too bad the administration does not engage DOT in discussions on this, we have the environmental approval so that's one less hurtle.
Lorraine DeVita January 11, 2013 at 02:36 PM
Beekay- it would be interesting to see the "progress" of the classes who did not perform as well as anticipated in those years. Also it would be interesting to narrow it down to WHO had WHO, what methodologies where imployed in those years and are those same people and methodologies still trending the same. That more then anything would indicate a "problem area" that needs to be addressed / recitified /eliminated. The results if nothing else support a keen need for focus on the elemenatry "foundation" and how it effects the learning process throughout their educational path. Itis better in my opinion to insure the early learning years are given as much attention/focus to insure the continuing layers of education built upon them are sound. IMHO It is harder to "correct" in the HS then to do it right intitally. Weak foundations make weakened buildings.
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 03:21 PM
James, I looked over your new links. 1.) Your elementary link is just the Harbor School, not both schools. Also, this link is data on our ESL students at the Harbor...a total of 6. How is this indicative of the district as a whole? 2.) And after quickly looking through the HS link you posted, there is nothing that stands out, much less lead one to believe the district neglects education.
James Norton January 11, 2013 at 07:33 PM
Beekay, Once again I apologize for the inaccurate link. Be patient I am a seaford graduate. Let's try this one. It is from newsday and only includes elementary math. It is a straight ranking in which you will find the 2 seaford schools at 148th and 238th. I find this to be unacceptable. There is a Massapequa school in 5th that is a neighboring district who is a lot more proactive when it comes to actual education. I have relatives there. They have new curriculum in every subject area, the technology includes 5 student computers in everyclassroom and they subscribe to various scholastic programs designed to increase fluency in reading and math. They have a fully integrated common core curriculum. http://longisland.newsday.com/schools/rankings.php?id=tests--Math-4
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 08:48 PM
James, you cannot use rankings for your case. Many districts nationwide have eliminated student rankings for this reason. Ranking the Manor at 148th sounds awful...but when you look closely, the Manor had 96.5% at L3 or L4. Seaford Harbor, ranked 238, had 93.3% at L3 or L4. The reason HS(s) are eliminating individual rankings is that students who attend high performing schools are unfairly judged since they may have a weighted GPA of over 100, yet might be in the 2nd or 3rd quartile in comparison. Basically our district is similar to one of these students since we are in a high performing section of NY. Forest Lake School in Wantagh is ranked at 243. I know people who either live and/or work there and are very happy with the school. Simply put, their ranking of 243 is biased data. Other district that have schools ranked 200 or lower on this list include Islip, Bellmore, Bayport-Blue Point, West Islip, Lynbook, Sayville, Oceanside, Northport, MASSAPEQUA (at 279 and 286), Bethpage, East Northport, Levittown, among many others - all districts I have heard good things about. So I will try once again, please provide data as to how the district is neglecting education. If it was, data would support a downward trend, which just hasn't happened. Looking forward to attempt #4 to support the claim.
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 08:49 PM
I agree Lorraine, it certainly would be an interesting study. Yes, it is certainly harder to "right the ship" at the HS level than it is to do so at the elementary level.
James Norton January 11, 2013 at 08:49 PM
ELA ranking by district puts the Manor at 140 and the harbor at 152. Both Massapequa and Wantagh have schools that are well below the 100 mark. As I said earlier I am not looking to bash but this is the town I live in and grew up in. It is troubling to watch as other comparible districts continue to move ahead and we seem to be stuck in time. My argument remains, lets focus on educating first. All of these other things wether it be real estate, construction or road buliding only detract from the function of a school system. http://longisland.newsday.com/schools/rankings.php?id=tests--English-4
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 08:51 PM
@Lorraine, agreed ^ I particularly agree with the importance of PR and academic accolades. We should make public acknowledgement of as many achievements as possible.
Chris Wendt January 11, 2013 at 08:52 PM
You do not understand of the meaning or the value of the data you are looking at and trying to interpret. Score L1 is not a grade of L1, but an indicator that a child requires and is entitled to receive remedial services under NCLB. Score L2 is not a grade of L2, but an indicator that a child requires and is entitled to receive supportive services under NCLB. It is vitally important that all children who require remedial or supportive services are identified correctly (as L1 or L2) and are this afforded those services. This is not a competition or a sports league, it is a measurement of the development of individual children at tender ages in order to insure the best outcomes for each of them on an individual basis, by starting services as early in their school careers as possible, as measured by these assessments. You misunderstanding of the "rank" of 148 and 238 for two elementary schools in a single district ignores the fact that fourth grade students in these schools were assessed as performing at or above grade level in Math at 96.5% and 93.3% on a grade-level student population basis of each individual building. That means, in one school only 3.5% of the fourth grade students require some type of remedial or supportive service to improve their math performance, while in the other school, only 6.7% of the fourth grade students require some service. Do not lose sight of the fact that these are fourth graders, children who are 8 or 9 years old.
Chris Wendt January 11, 2013 at 08:54 PM
The same thing goes for your misinterpretation of the ELA rankings. If these were "grades" then both schools would be on the Honor Roll for Math and English Language Arts.
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 08:54 PM
^ this link is 4th grade ELA rankings by school, not district. And how would a district ranking have the Manor and Harbor ranked differently. Oh boy.
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 09:05 PM
Anyhow, if you want to use this "district" ranking that you posted (which actually is 4th grade ELA by school, not district), here are some other notable districts neglecting education. These are all below the Harbor's ranking of 152 (I'll just say the district, not the school). Smithtown 153 and 206, Syosset 157 and 302, Bellmore, 159 and 162, MASSAPEQUA (161, 205, 224 and 267!), Wantagh (196), Plainview (189 and 190), Babylon 241, Bayport 242....among many other well renowned districts. Again, rankings are biased and do not accurately portray performance. Again, why would top HS(s) on LI eliminate student rankings? For exactly this reason. Biased data. Time for me to get off the computer, this is painful.
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 09:15 PM
Thank you Chris. I have all but given up trying to explain this to James. See my posts above. In addition to Seaford; Massapequa, Wantagh, Syosset, Babylon, Bayport, Islip, Northport, Plainview, Smithtown, and many others must be neglecting education as well.
Buster of Seaford January 11, 2013 at 09:20 PM
Can any homeowner residing near the SAS, anyone that in the (possibly near) future gets notice from the town of an impending rezoning hearing, please make a note of it via this thread? I'm sure there are some folks that would like to know about it, and be present at the hearing. And may otherwise not get word of it.
James Norton January 11, 2013 at 09:56 PM
Beekay, This is the type of complacent attitude that has thrived in Seaford for many years. As I stated the data is only as good as the way it is interpreted or perceived. I'm sure many see your this is "Good Enough" point of view and agree with you. That's the way its been for the 35 years I've been here. I really do hope things start to turn around here. However, if the community doesn't prioritize itself along with the board and administration the numbers will dip as they have done in the past. My goal here was to raise awareness to what should be important, which should be more investment, both time and money, into curriculum and programs. If we keep manufacturing these distractions Seaford will be left behind. When we as a community don't strive to better our children each year one must question the hub of the community, which is the school system.
BeeKay January 11, 2013 at 10:17 PM
@James, sorry but I am far from complacent. I expect the most out of my children, advocate for them, and am actively involved in their educations. So far you have supported your opinion based on data from 6 ESL students; 60,000 mystery students taking a test; 16,000 students taking a math Regents, and 4th grade ELA and Math levels. You used Massapequa as a reference in your argument, yet on the rankings you posted they had 4 elementary schools below the Manor and Harbor. I like how you only mentioned the 2 schools ranked high. What about the other 4 schools since we are talking about districts, not individual schools. The trend has been upward, not downward. There has been no neglect to education in recent years. You have not proven otherwise. Obviously there is room for improvement, as we should always look to improve. Please go back and reread this dialogue, paying careful attention to your false claims and inaccurate #s. It is wrong to mislead people, stick to the hard facts. Regardless, TGIF, enjoy the w/e.
Lorraine DeVita January 12, 2013 at 01:20 PM
Buster, apparently the BOE , EB/ Bk and Seafords legal counsel are in "talks" with the town- Apparently the TOH has a MAY deadline of 2013 - after that they concentrate on "elections" and if nothing is "accomplished" will not have further TALKS /hearings/discussions until December 2013-But it sounds like they are aggresively pushing for a MAY decision....so if something is not forthcoming VERY VERY soon then i would contact the TOH to see what the process is and be proactive like the BOE and EB/BK are. This was shared at the Budget Committee meeting.. I dont know if i am speaking out of class as there was no "whatever is said in this meeting is confidential" statement by anyone - so i am assuming that it is ok to share this with you as it was shared with us. I find it ironic this wasnt mentioned at the Board meeting ---and perhpas people should request a SAS status at the next one to confirm.
Lorraine DeVita January 12, 2013 at 02:03 PM
James- While i can understand the possible confusion in reading these reports and fully comprehending their relevence. I do have to bring to the forefront one thing. I commend you - YOU ARE CONCERNED enough about Education in Seaford and the education of YOUR child to make the effort do the research. and ask questions. Thats one thing I think many are overlooking. Parents ARE concerned - Parents are trying to be involved and become educated . That in and of itself speaks volumes for the FUTURE of education in our community. When parents ask questions about education, the process, the results, the PRIORITY and voice their concerns to the BOE and the Adminsitration things start to change for the better. Thank you for being concerned -
Lorraine DeVita January 12, 2013 at 03:33 PM
@ James- yes i agree complacency has thrived in Seaford , however I think the Tide is turning - I am encouraged by the number of parents now questioning the priorities of the district and while we have seen improvements, we need as a community to insure the district stays focused. As taxpayers we need ot hold the district accountable for its priorities and expenditures which impacts the Value of homes . As parents your task is much greater you need to hold the Sd accountable for the quality of your childs education as well as establishing and voicing your need for quality education being the priority to the SD leadership. The more people question and hold the Sd leadership responsible and accountable the more likely we are to see improvements & progress.
Hilarity Jones January 12, 2013 at 07:16 PM
Lorraine, your incessant belittling of the BOE and parents of this community has become tiresome. I and most others find your constant barrage of negativity regarding this communities educational system truly remarkable. You have never provided anything positive, other than an occasional backhanded compliment, or a "maybe" we are making strides. Just because every parent does not go to BOE meetings and harrangue the board at every turn, like you do, does not make anyone complacent or uncencerned. You can not deny this as I have seen it first hand. Your consistant negativity regarding sports and music as inconsequential and overemphasized parts of the educational process is also over the top. Music and athletics have afforded many, many students in this district as well as all others the opportunity for exceptional collegiate careers that might not have been available to them otherwise. Sports and music are without a doubt the largest extracurricular activities offered at all schools, including your vaunted Catholic High Schools. Education does not suffer because of these programs, it is enhanced by them. So for my and everyone elses sake please stop. Your need to be heard from West Hempstead to Wantagh as the scion of negativity has grown old.and irrelevant. If you are unable to make your comments regarding education and the people and parents involved positive, please keep them to yourself.
ergodic January 12, 2013 at 11:05 PM
A review of the Grade 3-8 Composite PI data (12/27/12; 6:10pm) uncovered an error in some calculations. Though some numbers change, there is no effect on the previous commentary. the revised Gr 3-8 table follows: ---Dist-----------------Composite PI--------% proficient ------------------------2012------2011--------2012ELA ---Seaford----------176.4-----174.3----------74.1 --Wantagh----------180.7-----179.4----------78.2 Massapeq----------184.7-----180.3----------82.3 ----Jericho----------189.6-----189.0----------86.9 ----Nassau----------170.5-----169.6----------70.5 --NYS LowNeeds--------------------------------77.2 The above 4 districts are among those designated by NYSED as "Low Needs" (based on district's ability to meet needs of its students. Comparison with aver performance of Low Needs districts is therefore pertinent. It is also noted that the goal of NCLB was for all students to be proficient in reading & math in 2013-14. In May 2012, NYS was granted an esea-waiver from many NCLB rqmts; the current goal is to reduce the gap between each accountability group and a PI of 200 (baseline=2010-11) by half in 6 years (2016-17).
Patrick M January 17, 2013 at 04:39 AM
It is now 1/16 (more than a month after the vote) and the sign next to the Seaford Avenue School remains
Joe January 17, 2013 at 01:24 PM
I think that covered it in the nut shell!!


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